Wellbutrin

Post any data on Treatments and experimentation.
raven100
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by raven100 »

RainebowGirl wrote:Tiny update! I am almost using this as a personal log thread at this point. If I'm posting too much, let me know and I'll stop.

My arousal and libido are up! Like 80% almost! And my numbness has gone down a bit!

No, I haven't taken any more. I was afraid to, so I waited two more weeks and it seems like waiting gave me slightly more improvements. It's not a window - or, at least I hope not - because the improvements have been slowly and consistently showing themselves. I might try one more experiment in a little bit longer. I feel like every dose kickstarts my brain: I sleep better, my feet and hands don't get cold as easily, and my mood is stabilized for a few weeks. Then it drops and slowly recovers. I'm no neuroscientist, so I can't say what's really happening, but that's what it feels like. Each dose gives me a ton of improvement that slowly ebbs down, but improves my baseline. I'm sure it'll stop at some point, but it hasn't been so far. Good sign?

I almost feel foolish for not having tried this sooner, but it wasn't until I found this board that I realized what reinstatement even was. Plus, it gave me time to get my body healthier. Maybe it is for the best.

Oh! Goosebumps! From the smallest things! I didn't realize how common this must be for everyday people until now. I also get very sad very easily, much easier than before. It's better than being numb, though, yeah? Maybe?
-
I decided to use my chart thing again, to help me see my progress:
Genital numbness: 65%. Still comes and goes, but it is typically better, as long as I don't 'play the devil's fiddle', if y'know what I mean :lol: I mostly choose not to, as I feel I make more progress that way.
Libido: 75%. I am starting to not like this. As I've mentioned, I was hypersexual before this all started. I feel my libido heading back up, which I was most comfortable around 60ish%. I also don't like *feeling* lonely. I feel that now. I used to not care about having a partner and could focus on myself pretty easily, but the last week, I have felt loneliness creeping up on me. I don't like it.
Lubrication: 45-50%, around the normal amount for most women, I think. I'm kind of okay here, honestly, so I hope it doesn't go back to what it was.
Spontaneous arousal: 80% Aaaaah, along with the libido thing! It surprises me throughout the day sometimes...
Anhedonia: ??%. I feel things, but it is usually sadness and loneliness. I still have very little interest in things, but it feels less like a lack of interest and more like I'm too *sad* to enjoy doing anything. I don't like it.
Anorgasmia: 75% I can have orgasms fairly easily now, but they're not *as* easy as before and aren't as strong. <--this remained the same.
Pelvic floor: ??%. Still fucked up, no idea how to fix it. Still get random pelvic pain with no idea how to stretch or pressure point it, honestly.
Check out the book 'A Headache In the Pelvis' by David Wise if you can
PSSD Since March 2016 after 4 weeks on Sertraline
Conditioned worsened and peaked in April, since then possibly seen a 20% improvement
Would be useful for data collection if people could add their histories in their signature
Knifli
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by Knifli »

That's awesome Rainebow :D i'm glad this is working so good for you. Do you still feel disconnected from your emotions? (That's one of my most annoying symptoms)
Sertraline jan-jul 2018
taarn
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by taarn »

Bupropion always used to give me increase in sexual function the first/second day while taking it and that disappeared following the third day. Probably I will have to wait for a month or longer for it to really kick in, for some it didn't work when they took it for months so it's very random.
Now I'm taking Wellbutrin 150mg combined with 0,16mg of pramipexole. Today I noticed a definite libido uplift and also somewhat increased genital sensitivity. That's huge for me cause except a three days window in january I constantly have close to zero sexual function.

There are multiple reasons I added pramipexole:
- I always seemed to react to dopaminergics and I highly suspect dopaminergic signaling in core brain areas related to sexual function is underactive. Bupropion is only a very mild dopaminergic agent, so give a little boost.
- Pramipexole was shown to upregulate D2 and D3 receptor expression
- I have problems with the noradrenergic properties of Wellbutrin. I have mild OCD and I'm prone to anxiety and sleep issues and above 150mg these issues start to worsen.

So by adding prami it was easier to achieve more pronounced effects instead of simply by raising the dose of Wellbutrin (bupropion). Of course pramipexole is not recommended to be taken long term but so far it seems to have a synergistic effect. Also this combination isn't the safest and is not recommended for everyone. That's why I'm also taking such a low dose.
Idk how long this effect will last but I have very stubborn sexual dysfunction and seeing that I'm not terminally damaged in this context caused me to feel a bit relieved.
RainebowGirl
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by RainebowGirl »

raven100 wrote: Check out the book 'A Headache In the Pelvis' by David Wise if you can
Omg thank you! I will! That's almost exactly what it feels like, actually. I'm definitely buying this asap.
Knifli wrote:That's awesome Rainebow :D i'm glad this is working so good for you. Do you still feel disconnected from your emotions? (That's one of my most annoying symptoms)
Thank you! Slowly, but surely, I'm starting to reconnect with them. I don't know how to describe it, but... it's almost like my brain has to slowly regain the skill to react to certain things--it was small, at first, but I'm having stronger reactions as time goes by (not mega strong, mind you--it's like I went from 0% to 35% lol). I can think of something, well, arousing, and get that "pulse" feeling now in response, which I didn't really get before and I felt like my thoughts were very disconnected from my physicality.

I mentioned in my last post, but my reaction to music is still one of the most noticeable to me - I get goosebumps fairly easily from songs that move me, reactions I haven't felt for years (I didn't connect the "no more goosebumps" thing to pssd until I came here, so I appreciate this forum a lot!) The mental headrush from the goosebumps aren't very long lasting, though. It's like a split second of a rush and goosebumps and then it's gone. I don't remember if that's normal if it lasts longer/has more of an impact in non-PSSD folks.

Oh, and I haven't changed anything in my diet or lifestyle besides the wellbutrin. I guess I've slept more this month, maybe.
Last edited by RainebowGirl on Sun Mar 31, 2019 1:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
:?
Used Effexor, Wellbutrin from 2012 - 2015. PSSD 4Y after.
Reinstated with Wellbutrin from March 2019 - May 2019. 65% improvement that leveled out closer to 40%.
Implemented yoga and pelvic floor therapy on and off.
Now at 85%! :mrgreen:
RainebowGirl
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Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2019 10:42 pm
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by RainebowGirl »

taarn wrote:Bupropion always used to give me increase in sexual function the first/second day while taking it and that disappeared following the third day. Probably I will have to wait for a month or longer for it to really kick in, for some it didn't work when they took it for months so it's very random.
Now I'm taking Wellbutrin 150mg combined with 0,16mg of pramipexole. Today I noticed a definite libido uplift and also somewhat increased genital sensitivity. That's huge for me cause except a three days window in january I constantly have close to zero sexual function.

There are multiple reasons I added pramipexole:
- I always seemed to react to dopaminergics and I highly suspect dopaminergic signaling in core brain areas related to sexual function is underactive. Bupropion is only a very mild dopaminergic agent, so give a little boost.
- Pramipexole was shown to upregulate D2 and D3 receptor expression
- I have problems with the noradrenergic properties of Wellbutrin. I have mild OCD and I'm prone to anxiety and sleep issues and above 150mg these issues start to worsen.

So by adding prami it was easier to achieve more pronounced effects instead of simply by raising the dose of Wellbutrin (bupropion). Of course pramipexole is not recommended to be taken long term but so far it seems to have a synergistic effect. Also this combination isn't the safest and is not recommended for everyone. That's why I'm also taking such a low dose.
Idk how long this effect will last but I have very stubborn sexual dysfunction and seeing that I'm not terminally damaged in this context caused me to feel a bit relieved.
That's great, Taarn! I'm so glad you're seeing results! For how long are you able to take Prami?

And yeah, it seems like it doesn't work as well for a lot of people. I'm thinking maybe I'm reacting to it because it was one of the ADs I was on when I developed PSSD in the first place (the other was Effexor)?

My progress isn't super drastic and it's taking weeks to show any improvement, but I'm a lot better now than I was when I started learning from this forum, so I thank you and everyone else who contributes what they know and have experienced. I wouldn't have tried this without you.

The reason I've been waiting a week or two between doses is that I'm trying not to take it too close together or too many at a time so I don't mess up my progress. I'm terrified of desensitizing my 5-HT1A autoreceptors (or doing it even more). If that results in me only being partially cured, I'll take it.
:?
Used Effexor, Wellbutrin from 2012 - 2015. PSSD 4Y after.
Reinstated with Wellbutrin from March 2019 - May 2019. 65% improvement that leveled out closer to 40%.
Implemented yoga and pelvic floor therapy on and off.
Now at 85%! :mrgreen:
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Ghost
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by Ghost »

@RainebowGirl i have the pdf. Anyone can email me and I can help them out with it. :)
- Medical Student & Friendly poltergeist - Lexapro Sept '14. [Hx] [PSSD Lab] [r/PSSD] [Treatment Plan] - Add "Ghost" in replies so I see it :)
taarn
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by taarn »

RainebowGirl wrote:That's great, Taarn! I'm so glad you're seeing results! For how long are you able to take Prami?

And yeah, it seems like it doesn't work as well for a lot of people. I'm thinking maybe I'm reacting to it because it was one of the ADs I was on when I developed PSSD in the first place (the other was Effexor)?

My progress isn't super drastic and it's taking weeks to show any improvement, but I'm a lot better now than I was when I started learning from this forum, so I thank you and everyone else who contributes what they know and have experienced. I wouldn't have tried this without you.

The reason I've been waiting a week or two between doses is that I'm trying not to take it too close together or too many at a time so I don't mess up my progress. I'm terrified of desensitizing my 5-HT1A autoreceptors (or doing it even more). If that results in me only being partially cured, I'll take it.
I guess it depends on person, genetics, personal tolerance, the nature of damage caused by AD meds, etc.. But for low doses one should be able to take it for several months without issues. Pramipexole also seems to be more neuroprotective and having some benefits compared to most other dopamine agonists.

I can totally understand how you feel about 5-HT1A! But I think we give too much attention to those receptors.
I was also debating on taking Wellbutrin cause bupropion was shown to early (just in 2 days) desensitize 5-HT1A by an adrenoreceptors mediated mechanism. But I never experienced any sexually negative effect from it, rather the opposite.
I think 5-HT1A desensitization is just a downstream event in the chain of events what causes PSSD. Agonizing/antagonizing those receptors can help/worsen your situation but this is more complicated, there are possible issues with SERT, neurosteroids which are the main culprit I think, not to mention possible epigenetic changes. Also other neurotransmitter systems that can play a possible role, and it would be good to know what causes f*cked up neural (peripheral) signaling in some.
RainebowGirl
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by RainebowGirl »

Ghost wrote:@RainebowGirl i have the pdf. Anyone can email me and I can help them out with it. :)
Thank you so much, Ghost!
taarn wrote: I think 5-HT1A desensitization is just a downstream event in the chain of events what causes PSSD. Agonizing/antagonizing those receptors can help/worsen your situation but this is more complicated, there are possible issues with SERT, neurosteroids which are the main culprit I think, not to mention possible epigenetic changes. Also other neurotransmitter systems that can play a possible role, and it would be good to know what causes f*cked up neural (peripheral) signaling in some.
Very true. There's so much that anti-depressants can change neurologically. It's so overwhelming.
:?
Used Effexor, Wellbutrin from 2012 - 2015. PSSD 4Y after.
Reinstated with Wellbutrin from March 2019 - May 2019. 65% improvement that leveled out closer to 40%.
Implemented yoga and pelvic floor therapy on and off.
Now at 85%! :mrgreen:
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magnilo
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by magnilo »

taarn wrote:Bupropion always used to give me increase in sexual function the first/second day while taking it and that disappeared following the third day. Probably I will have to wait for a month or longer for it to really kick in, for some it didn't work when they took it for months so it's very random.
Now I'm taking Wellbutrin 150mg combined with 0,16mg of pramipexole. Today I noticed a definite libido uplift and also somewhat increased genital sensitivity. That's huge for me cause except a three days window in january I constantly have close to zero sexual function.

There are multiple reasons I added pramipexole:
- I always seemed to react to dopaminergics and I highly suspect dopaminergic signaling in core brain areas related to sexual function is underactive. Bupropion is only a very mild dopaminergic agent, so give a little boost.
- Pramipexole was shown to upregulate D2 and D3 receptor expression
- I have problems with the noradrenergic properties of Wellbutrin. I have mild OCD and I'm prone to anxiety and sleep issues and above 150mg these issues start to worsen.

So by adding prami it was easier to achieve more pronounced effects instead of simply by raising the dose of Wellbutrin (bupropion). Of course pramipexole is not recommended to be taken long term but so far it seems to have a synergistic effect. Also this combination isn't the safest and is not recommended for everyone. That's why I'm also taking such a low dose.
Idk how long this effect will last but I have very stubborn sexual dysfunction and seeing that I'm not terminally damaged in this context caused me to feel a bit relieved.
hi taarn, im interested in your reports, could you please articulate "increased libido" a bit more? merely your desire to engage in sexual activities, or the spontaneous arousal and mechanical aspects of it are improved? asking because my libido is really high, but my response to events and sensitivity is dampened. personally i have a kinda "addictive" type of personality, always looking for dopamine spikes (porn, videogames, girls), and im really skeptic on how to proceed. anything that might make that worse is a no no
taarn
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Re: Wellbutrin

Unread post by taarn »

magnilo wrote:hi taarn, im interested in your reports, could you please articulate "increased libido" a bit more? merely your desire to engage in sexual activities, or the spontaneous arousal and mechanical aspects of it are improved? asking because my libido is really high, but my response to events and sensitivity is dampened. personally i have a kinda "addictive" type of personality, always looking for dopamine spikes (porn, videogames, girls), and im really skeptic on how to proceed. anything that might make that worse is a no no
Hi magnilo! Under increased libido I mean I'm able to spur out some emotions when looking or thinking at girls, that's the emotional side, the desire for the opposite sex. Libido also means that inner urge, that inner tension what I just feel, the urge to either have sex or masturbate, the urge for release. I think the sensitivity part is more straightforward.

My baseline is almost totally being asexual, no sexual thoughts, no cravings. When looking at the opposite sex it's like looking at a beautiful painting, yeah it's beautiful, cool, but that's all. That apathy scares me, if I had grown up like this, I guess I have never developed any attraction towards women.
That inner urge I just mentioned is also missing, I can just get away for a long time without any form of release. Rarely I feel something, either some urge or restlessness because the absence of 'release' or sometimes I'm able to feel some attraction. Pleasure is totally missing from my genital area, orgasms are close to being totally pleasureless, if I had some improvement on the libido side, that day probably orgasms feel a few % better, but still no pleasure until the buildup to orgasm. And there is more to this sensitivity issue, because my whole genital area feels detached from my brain, like I lost control over those muscles and nerves, I have a weird feeling overrall.

So for the previous 2 days I've noticed improvements in almost every aspect. I had a somewhat sexual dream, a random girl kissed me lol. The weird feeling totally disappeared from my genital area, like I got back the control, urinating also became easier. I had some pleasure returning but it was mostly limited to the pelvic muscles and area, the penis itself was still missing pleasure. The 'urge' side of libido improved, I just felt that randomly appearing. The emotional side barely improved, although women felt more than like a beautiful painting I didn't really craved them.
Unfortunately the effects mostly vanished for today, I took ginkgo yesterday but I don't think that it had such a big impact. Probably I should have conducted fewer 'tests' in the weekend lol but it's hard to gauge.

What I also notice while doing this regimen is that my thinking became a bit slower, or I would rather say it's a bit harder to concentrate. And sometimes it's a bit harder to recall things, so a bit worse on the memory side. It might be caused by the mild anticholinergic properties of bupropion. But I have to note that I achieved the biggest improvements on my cognitive function and focus in the recent 1-2 months, after taking the correct supplements and trying to live more healthy. I was in the best shape of my life in this context I guess, in part thanks to the reduced anxiety and OCD which all came with PSSD.
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