Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Post any data on Treatments and experimentation.
CN9
Posts: 49
Joined: Sun May 17, 2020 1:49 pm
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by CN9 »

Twentyoneguns wrote: Sun Jan 03, 2021 2:23 pm Drugs/supplements that have caused a crash in my symptoms.

MACCA ROOT
I took two capsules of this, after the first I experienced a calming effect which was quite good, after the second my libido took a real dive. I discontinued due to this effect, it took around a week to return to baseline though I feel a slight negative effect remained.

GINKGO BILOBA
I took one tablet in the morning and later that day I found I was unable to reach orgasm, this resolved after about a week, but during this period I felt pretty miserable.

LEVOTHYROXINE
I took this as a result of a raised TSH (5.9) i.e. Hypothyroidism which my doctor pointed out could be the cause of several medical problems I was having. Initially I refused treatment and asked to have my TSH re tested after a few months to see if it was a temporary condition. The TSH remained raised so I commenced a trial of 25mg Levothyoxine daily. I was retested two months later and the TSH remained at 5.9, I decided to stop the trial. I did notice a sudden total of interest in sex which at the time I put down to a stressful six month period in my personal life and CFS. I didn’t initially link the Levothyroxine with the loss of interest in sex. My girlfriend and I used to have and enjoy sex regularly, since this problem we have had sex just a handful of times in 15 months. It may have been the stress, but I think joining the dots after the event I think the Levotyroxine was the culprit. The CFS resolved after around 4-5 months.
I have since found that Soy products can raise TSH, I had replaced dairy milk with soy milk in my diet a year or so earlier. I have now reverted to using dairy milk and the TSH now stands at 3.9 (0.27-4.2 considered normal by my test facility)

HYDROCORTISONE CREAM 0.5% (Timodine cream)
I was prescribed this to clear up a stubborn fungal infection in my bum crack. I used it as prescribed for seven days. I noticed a few days after treatment that my penis showed signs of atrophy, I was horrified and immediately associated it with the Timodine cream use. I calmed down a bit but after about a month other problems started to emerge.
CFS returned
Tinnitus increased
Insomnia increased
Pain in genital and prostate area
Total ED
Any interest in sex gone completely
Dry mouth
Headaches
Occasional flutter in my chest
Lost 2kg
Depression and Anxiety
Suicidal thoughts.
To me it seems the hydrocortisone has caused Adrenal insufficiency. I’m hoping for the Adrenals to make a recovery.
None of the physical symptoms have improved in the 4 months since finishing the treatment.

As the number of posts in this thread increase its obvious that virtually any drug/supplement/food can cause a further worsening of PSSD symptoms.

It’s probably not a good idea to try to “cure” any ailment with prescription drugs unless its life threatening.

My PSSD has been transformed from something I could cope with to something terrible.

21
English is not my first language and I have difficulties to understand if L-Thyroxine helped you or not
finities infinities
Posts: 175
Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2019 9:37 am
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by finities infinities »

All Cb1 agonist direct and indirect ( FAAH inhibitors, corticosteroid, Cat Claw, Salvia etc) and 5ht1a agonist ( indirect and direct) like buspirone and 5htp, MDMA, carbamazepine, lamotrigine, CBD and of course SSRIs. It is now certain that these receptors are very strongly involved in PSSD and almost all form depersonalizations, anhedonia, OCD. I would also add 5ht7 antagonists which will desensitize 5ht1a rapidly and upregulate NMDA.
Thomas
Posts: 169
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2020 6:32 am
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Thomas »

finities infinities wrote: Mon Jan 18, 2021 10:52 am All Cb1 agonist direct and indirect ( FAAH inhibitors, corticosteroid, Cat Claw, Salvia etc) and 5ht1a agonist ( indirect and direct) like buspirone and 5htp, MDMA, carbamazepine, lamotrigine, CBD and of course SSRIs. It is now certain that these receptors are very strongly involved in PSSD and almost all form depersonalizations, anhedonia, OCD. I would also add 5ht7 antagonists which will desensitize 5ht1a rapidly and upregulate NMDA.
This is quite theoritical. I haven't read any report of sexual dysfunction induced by buspirone, for instance.
Besides, I don't see why we should avoid both direct and indirect agonists (which do the opposite). Except with the argument "avoid everything".
Escitalopram, 10mg/day, Jan-May 2019. Fluoxetine, May-Sept 2019. Mirtazapine, November 2019-January 2020. Escitalopram, Feb-May 2020.
Symptoms: low libido | sexual numbness | insomnia
Tree
Posts: 84
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:56 pm
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Tree »

It depends on the degree to which 5ht1a receptors are desensitized. There are people who are completely debilitated by the cognitive symptoms of pssd, including myself, so they are very sensitive to agonists and/or anything that increases 5ht release. It's good practice for anyone with any degree of pssd to avoid agonists because they come with a high risk of desensitizing serotonin receptors even more.
Thomas
Posts: 169
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2020 6:32 am
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Thomas »

Tree wrote: Mon Jan 18, 2021 9:21 pm It's good practice for anyone with any degree of pssd to avoid agonists because they come with a high risk of desensitizing serotonin receptors even more.
I would fully agree with you, would you have said "It's good practice for anyone with any degree of pssd to avoid everything before a strict assessment of benefits / risks". And your theory is plausible.
But here we intend to list the things we should avoid the most. If we want to avoid listing every known molecule, I think we should limit this list to products that respect the following two criteria:
1) Scientific study backing-up the theory, at least in vitro (for instance we have proofs on rats regarding SSRI induced desensitizing - and SSRIs don't work like an agonist btw) -> beacause our condition mixes psychological and physiological causes, we should try to focus on the latests (otherwise we will be dismissed forever with the "psychological" explaination).
2) At least few reports of sufferers -> because what happens in vitro doesn't always happen on human bodies.
Buspirone doesn't meet any of these criteria, afaik.
Escitalopram, 10mg/day, Jan-May 2019. Fluoxetine, May-Sept 2019. Mirtazapine, November 2019-January 2020. Escitalopram, Feb-May 2020.
Symptoms: low libido | sexual numbness | insomnia
Tree
Posts: 84
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:56 pm
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Tree »

Thomas wrote: Tue Jan 19, 2021 3:29 am
Tree wrote: Mon Jan 18, 2021 9:21 pm It's good practice for anyone with any degree of pssd to avoid agonists because they come with a high risk of desensitizing serotonin receptors even more.
I would fully agree with you, would you have said "It's good practice for anyone with any degree of pssd to avoid everything before a strict assessment of benefits / risks". And your theory is plausible.
But here we intend to list the things we should avoid the most. If we want to avoid listing every known molecule, I think we should limit this list to products that respect the following two criteria:
1) Scientific study backing-up the theory, at least in vitro (for instance we have proofs on rats regarding SSRI induced desensitizing - and SSRIs don't work like an agonist btw) -> beacause our condition mixes psychological and physiological causes, we should try to focus on the latests (otherwise we will be dismissed forever with the "psychological" explaination).
2) At least few reports of sufferers -> because what happens in vitro doesn't always happen on human bodies.
Buspirone doesn't meet any of these criteria, afaik.
Fair enough, man. My point is I think the 5ht1a desensitization theory is the most plausible given the literature and my experiences. Could I be wrong, or is there something else besides 5ht1a desensitization causing pssd? Sure. With the limited information on pssd, it's risky taking agonists.

The literature shows that ssri's taken with 5ht1a agonists increases antidepressant effects by further desensitizing the receptor. It's also not recommended to combine agonists with ssri because of the greater risk of developing serotonin syndrome.

There are few reported cases because pssd is a very rare condition
Also most people with pssd are not experimenting with agonists.
Last edited by Tree on Sun Jan 24, 2021 10:40 pm, edited 4 times in total.
Markc1113
Posts: 207
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2019 5:32 pm
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Markc1113 »

I do think it’s some sort of receptor desensitized based on my own experience. I have all the sexual issues and have tried wellebutrin twice to counteract it. Both times I either had no change while taking it or slightly worse. Yet when I would start to taper, on the off days I was better. All the way to the point of being better almost a month after tapering off it. Almost like something resets .
Thomas
Posts: 169
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2020 6:32 am
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Thomas »

Tree wrote: Sun Jan 24, 2021 8:30 pm My point is I think the 5ht1a desensitization theory is the most plausible given the literature and my experiences. Could I be wrong, or is there something else besides 5ht1a desensitization causing pssd? Sure. With the limited information on pssd, it's risky taking agonists.
I don't challenge this theory (or others). I just say "permanent" desensitization with agonists was not proven in vivo (to my knowledge).
Escitalopram, 10mg/day, Jan-May 2019. Fluoxetine, May-Sept 2019. Mirtazapine, November 2019-January 2020. Escitalopram, Feb-May 2020.
Symptoms: low libido | sexual numbness | insomnia
Tree
Posts: 84
Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2019 2:56 pm
Contact:

Re: Worst offenders for PSSD and things to avoid taking

Unread post by Tree »

Thomas wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:23 am
Tree wrote: Sun Jan 24, 2021 8:30 pm My point is I think the 5ht1a desensitization theory is the most plausible given the literature and my experiences. Could I be wrong, or is there something else besides 5ht1a desensitization causing pssd? Sure. With the limited information on pssd, it's risky taking agonists.
I don't challenge this theory (or others). I just say "permanent" desensitization with agonists was not proven in vivo (to my knowledge).
Long term ssri use has been shown to decouple girk channels causing receptor desensitization. Pretty sure agonists do too but not sure if decoupling causes permanent receptor desensitization.
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests