If Not PSSD, Then What?

General discussions. Feel free to use this like a support group also.
Brain food
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by Brain food »

There are some studies that show Cabergoline helps some men with anorgasmia but it doesn’t seem to help people with PSSD.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4822480/

https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... t_Analysis
Daboba
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by Daboba »

Brain food wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:54 pm There are some studies that show Cabergoline helps some men with anorgasmia but it doesn’t seem to help people with PSSD.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4822480/

https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... t_Analysis
Hey Brain,

I saw that bout Cabergoline too, but I’ve seen that it hasn’t helped many here. Also a lot of people say it should be last resort medication as it’s quite strong stuff so I’m quite hesitant. Quite a predicament PSSD is, honestly.
lukejimmy
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by lukejimmy »

Daboba wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:56 pm
lukejimmy wrote: Fri Jul 29, 2022 2:08 pm Did you by any chance binge porn, recreational drugs or something along those lines lately prior to the symptoms? I ask because my PSSD(?) coincided with my discovery of porn and subsequent addiction. This lead to intense confusion for me as people suffering from either independently report ALL the same symptoms, I can't thing of one that is unique to one or the other. Making me doubt the existence of PSSD at all half the time.

It 100% isn't PSSD in my opinion and has to be another unrelated factor in your case. You should definitely completely forget about what you're experiencing for the time being and then months from now reflect on how you've recovered from these symptoms. Worst thing you could do is panic that you've got a permanent condition in such a tiny timeframe, especially in your case where its almost 0% chance it is stemming from SSRI's.
Admittedly, I did watch a lot of porn. But I don't see how that ties in with every inch of my skin becoming muted in sensation, as well as anaesathised genitals etc. I've never used recreational drugs. I'm certain it's PSSD because the symptoms are just too uniformed with everyone elses. The loss of sensation, the insomnia, muscle numbness, anhedonia (though somewhat improved, slightly) etc.

My worry is that the SSRI's did damage, or made some alterations and then some sort of trigger (more than likely stress as I can't think of me taking anything in the meantime) that's caused PSSD to develop. But due to the lack of understanding around the condition itself, it's impossible to know what's going :\
Don’t stress your Prolactin levels support my theory despite me only looking at the test results right now. Ejaculation raises prolactin significantly long term, declining only after week(s)(?)) of abstinence if I’m remembering correctly.

As for the skin muting and genital anaesthesia these are 100% caused by porn use, don’t take my word for it google search will show anecdotes from porn addicts and people on a nofap forums recovering/abstaining.

Actually porn addicts commonly claim they use porn to numb themselves and their emotions. Through a similar mechanism it’s causing your skin numbness? I can confirm after porn and SSRIs at age 13ish my soul and the magic of the world have been numbed, a huge contrast to my childhood.

What is the timeframe of your porn use, I mean if you’ve only just recently discovered it prior to these symptoms your suffering then you’ve solved the mystery of both our PSSD’s?
lukejimmy
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by lukejimmy »

Daboba wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:23 pm
Brain food wrote: Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:54 pm There are some studies that show Cabergoline helps some men with anorgasmia but it doesn’t seem to help people with PSSD.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4822480/

https://www.researchgate.net/publicatio ... t_Analysis
Hey Brain,

I saw that bout Cabergoline too, but I’ve seen that it hasn’t helped many here. Also a lot of people say it should be last resort medication as it’s quite strong stuff so I’m quite hesitant. Quite a predicament PSSD is, honestly.
I was too enthusiastic and desperate enough to try Cabergoline. I was having serious trouble breathing and was on the verge of visiting a hospital. Scary stuff, plus theirs plenty of natural supplements that potently raise dopamine and decrease prolactin.
6-Eggs!
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by 6-Eggs! »

It's quite odd that you have these symptoms and so long after the drugs were last taken. But it might have nothing to do with the ssris.

I got sexual dysfunction and severe fatigue out of the blue which I think it might have been work related stresses, that then slowly turned into depression over the following several months, mainly due to the unexplained crippling sexual dysfunction and fatigue.

I never had taken drugs or anything up to that point of that happening. I didn't have numbness but I did loose erotic sensation and all libido but still had some desire. I was not able to get an erection at all for 2 or so years and orgasms were extremely weak. My ejaculate volume was reduced to about a half dozen or less grains of rice and were bright white and solid like jello (jelly for us Aussies). I also had a sore penis after having that weak orgasm that lasted about a day each time.

No one could explain it and just attributed it to stress and depression but I had the sexual problems and fatigue start months before what I would call depression had sunk in.

I was highly over worked (12-14 hour days, 5 days a week) some days were 20-22 hours due to interstate fly in fly out jobs which were about 1/3rd of my total year. I was also on min wage doing a job that should be paying 100k + allowances. I am sure this was what broke me as I was an anxious person and having to do that much work and all by myself with so much responsibility, it's no surprise, especially for a early 20s bloke with no life or prior long term job experiences. I was very unhappy after a few years of working there once I figured out there was no way for me to grow.

I naturally recovered mostly but still suffered low libido but was functional otherwise sexually. I still struggled with my new job (same thing but different company) and had to leave for a year for mental health treatment. This is where the drugs came in that broke my nervous system which made my sexual function much worse again and causes wide spread numbness and sensory hallucinations and motor/autonomic dysfunctions which have persisted about 9 months so far.

I had used SSRIs previously many years prior (between initial onset and the last lot of drug treatment). I had no issues with lingering symptoms once I stopped SSRIs, only when on them and I always stopped them cold turkey without issues. It's the antipsychotics that caused all my issues. That was quite obvious as my first dose reduction while tapering would only account for about <10% receptor occupancy drop, but holy poop balls, the withdrawals were horrific from such a small change.


Anyway, it could be possible some of the symptoms might be a similar environmental trigger like mine was and like some of the other's have said, could be more susceptible due to prior ssri use. It takes the brain years to get back to baseline after any drug use after looking at all the data and more recent research.
Daboba
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by Daboba »

6-Eggs! wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 1:39 am It's quite odd that you have these symptoms and so long after the drugs were last taken. But it might have nothing to do with the ssris.

I got sexual dysfunction and severe fatigue out of the blue which I think it might have been work related stresses, that then slowly turned into depression over the following several months, mainly due to the unexplained crippling sexual dysfunction and fatigue.

I never had taken drugs or anything up to that point of that happening. I didn't have numbness but I did loose erotic sensation and all libido but still had some desire. I was not able to get an erection at all for 2 or so years and orgasms were extremely weak. My ejaculate volume was reduced to about a half dozen or less grains of rice and were bright white and solid like jello (jelly for us Aussies). I also had a sore penis after having that weak orgasm that lasted about a day each time.

No one could explain it and just attributed it to stress and depression but I had the sexual problems and fatigue start months before what I would call depression had sunk in.

I was highly over worked (12-14 hour days, 5 days a week) some days were 20-22 hours due to interstate fly in fly out jobs which were about 1/3rd of my total year. I was also on min wage doing a job that should be paying 100k + allowances. I am sure this was what broke me as I was an anxious person and having to do that much work and all by myself with so much responsibility, it's no surprise, especially for a early 20s bloke with no life or prior long term job experiences. I was very unhappy after a few years of working there once I figured out there was no way for me to grow.

I naturally recovered mostly but still suffered low libido but was functional otherwise sexually. I still struggled with my new job (same thing but different company) and had to leave for a year for mental health treatment. This is where the drugs came in that broke my nervous system which made my sexual function much worse again and causes wide spread numbness and sensory hallucinations and motor/autonomic dysfunctions which have persisted about 9 months so far.

I had used SSRIs previously many years prior (between initial onset and the last lot of drug treatment). I had no issues with lingering symptoms once I stopped SSRIs, only when on them and I always stopped them cold turkey without issues. It's the antipsychotics that caused all my issues. That was quite obvious as my first dose reduction while tapering would only account for about <10% receptor occupancy drop, but holy poop balls, the withdrawals were horrific from such a small change.


Anyway, it could be possible some of the symptoms might be a similar environmental trigger like mine was and like some of the other's have said, could be more susceptible due to prior ssri use. It takes the brain years to get back to baseline after any drug use after looking at all the data and more recent research.
Hey 6-Egg,

Very weird indeed, I've been to a few specialists and I can't get any noteworthy information about what is causing my symptoms. Have had a full MRI and nothing. The theory I'm leaning on most is that the SSRI did some damage, though that being said wouldn't the years that have passed since taking an AD be time I've had a chance to heal in? It makes no sense to me, during that period I was sexually active, in the best condition physically and I had gotten a great job so I can't attribute my symptoms to stress, though we all have a degree of stress in our lives.

The genital numbness is a nuisance, some days I can feel patches on sensistivity, then the next day its back to every inch of skin being totally mute. Like you, my ejaculatory volume has decreased and I'm guessing the raised prolactin is playing part in that but again, not the full picture. The dullness in my skin hasn't budged, if I scratch my head, my scalp feels very meh, like I'm wearing a hat or something.

If there was a diagnosing criteria or test for PSSD it would at least help me rule it out as of now I'm driving myself crazy with theories. Is there any noteworthy tests that should be done to point towards PSSD as close as possible? When health professionals don't know the answer they seem to default on "stress/depression" which I know isn't the issue and I'm tired of hearing it from as their last card. I don't feel depressed as of right now, more so frustrated that I don't know what the underlying issue is.

Sometimes I get sharp pains that run along the shaft into the tip. Sometimes I can feel this pain when I walk/run. It subsisdes eventually but not sure what's causing it, have heard a few people here complain about similiar things. Idk if there's a test for such a symptom. Honestly not sure who's worth paying a visit at this point.

Thanks for your message, hope you're feeling better!
6-Eggs!
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by 6-Eggs! »

I have improved a lot actually. Numbness is all but gone, I'd say 90%+ most days now in my glans which was the last area to get better. And still have very slight numbness in the fingerprints of some of my fingers but most of the time it feels recovered. It's the odd phantom sensation on my face, hands, sometimes my forearms and my lower legs that is the most obvious lingering symptom. Feels like I am wearing cling warp on my skin in those areas and I get those feelings almost daily but they come and go quick, over minutes to no more than an hour or so.

As for sexual issues. The soft glans syndrome is very persistent but I do get windows often where it's almost normal. This overall has improved a lot since last year where it would not erect at all despite a normal shaft erection. I had great libido while I was drug free from about November to Jan when completely drug free but it went worse as soon as I restarted the taper and progressively got worse since but that is what the drug Rexulti does, sexual dysfunction is tardive with this drug. Fine at the start but gets worse the longer you stay on it, regardless of dose.

My orgasms and ejaculations are best it has ever been, even pre depression. So no issues there. Sex is very enjoyable but just hard to get in the mood in the first place, same arousal disorder I had when I was being treated with Rexulti and this is one of the symptoms that came back once I restarted with the taper, mild at the start but got worse over the last 6 months or so.

I am on 1/32nd normal dose now or 0.0625mg as of last week and withdrawal symptoms are there but less than the last reduction which was better than the one before and so forth. I have about 6 month of taper left before I stop. 3 months of this dose and then another 3 on 1/64th or 0.03125mg which should give me a receptor occupancy of less than 10%, I estimate about 7% so quitting should hopefully be not too bad and the real recovery can begin from there.

I would have likely avoided this all if I had known more about the drugs tardive effects and that the psychiatrist didn't bs me about "no sexual side effects". But even if I had still taken it, the missing info that would have avoided most if not all of this withdrawal syndrome is the recent info that anti depressants need to be tapered over several months to years and antipsychotics literally take years to taper properly. Info that was published mere couple of months after I tried to taper and stop the "recommended" way and yes, I researched the hell out of antipsychotic tapering protocols, there was simply no to little research backed data last year.

I was diagnosed with FND (functional neurological deficit), basically a name given when doctors can't explain a barrage of perplexing function neuro symptoms but I posted an article in the general section about FND being over looked as current or past psychotropic drug use being the cause. My doctors and specialists very well acknowledge that Rexulti is the cause of my symptoms but they still call is FND. It could very well be something like that caused by past SSRI use and some external trigger set it off. The brain and body are extremely complex.
heymartinn
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by heymartinn »

how much of creatine were you taking?
Daboba
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by Daboba »

heymartinn wrote: Tue Aug 09, 2022 12:44 pm how much of creatine were you taking?
One scoop of Optimum Nutrition, I think it’s 3/5g per scoop. I was taking that daily and was going gym 5 days a week. Was in the best shape of my life, peak strength etc. Then boom…
6-Eggs!
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Re: If Not PSSD, Then What?

Unread post by 6-Eggs! »

Recently joined Survivingantidepressants.org and seems this is a thing. A few mentions of very delayed withdrawal and sexual dysfunction coming more than a year later. Someone mentioned they got PGAD well over a year or maybe it was 2? after stopping an SSRI.

The whole site is extremely helpful and has 1000s of accounts of withdrawals from all kinds of symptoms and they do last years for most people. 3-4 seems average, some less but not common and some as long as 10 years in really bad cases but also not common. The delayed effect seems quite common and can range from months to years later.

PSSD is just part of this spectrum of protracted withdawals and not exclusive.
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